Paul's Here

The Next Group to be Sacrificed

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President Barack Obama said Thursday he is determined to get a credit-card law that eliminates the tricky fine print, sudden rate increases and late fees that give millions of consumers headaches.

"I trust that those in the industry who want to act responsibly will engage with us in a constructive fashion, and that we're going to get this done in short order," Obama said, delivering a pointed message to leading executives of credit-card issuing companies after a closed-door White House meeting.

Both the House and the Senate are pursuing bills to give consumers greater protections as an expansion of new rules slated to take effect next year. Obama said his economic advisers will examine the various proposals and work with Congress and the industry, but he made clear he wants to sign a bill into law.

"The days of any time, any reason rate hikes and late fee traps have to end," Obama said.

At issue is how to protect consumers, particularly in a deep recession, while not imposing the kind of rules that could make it harder for banks to offer credit or put credit out of reach for many borrowers.

Industry executives left the White House without talking to reporters.

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The president made no mention of the responsibility of consumers to keep themselves from getting overextended.

Obama pledges protections for credit-card users

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When are the leaders of these types of companies going to stand up and stop cowering.

When they can avoid the guns pointed at their heads.

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When are the leaders of these types of companies going to stand up and stop cowering.

When they can avoid the guns pointed at their heads.

Then they can live or die fighting for their lifes or they can live as cowering slaves and still die.

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When are the leaders of these types of companies going to stand up and stop cowering.

When they can avoid the guns pointed at their heads.

Then they can live or die fighting for their lifes or they can live as cowering slaves and still die.

Okay a quick prediction.

1. The credit card companies obviously did not pay enough/any tribute to the Messiah and are thus going to be hit with punitive legislation dressed up as consumer protection (watch for some gruesome closed door fund raisers pre-2012!)

2. The companies broadly accept the new legislation and respond by not offering credit cards to the highre risk users who would have otherwise been covered by bona fide contract terms

3. The greivance-mongers blame the companies for not offering credit to the "disadvantaged" and then one of two things happens, possibly in combination

(a) legislation is passed forcing the companies to give cards to anyone who appies thus forcing up costs for everyone else who now have to cover the feckless (like the CRA was for housing, and we know how well that worked out)

(B ) A Fannie-Mae type type government credit card is launched which is unpopular as it sympolises someone who is a pooor credit risk. The scheme looses millions and eventually collapses in a corruption scandal

All too predictable.

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When are the leaders of these types of companies going to stand up and stop cowering.

When they can avoid the guns pointed at their heads.

Then they can live or die fighting for their lifes or they can live as cowering slaves and still die.

"And for the support of this Declaration, with a firm reliance on the protection of Divine Providence, we mutually pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes and our sacred Honor."

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When are the leaders of these types of companies going to stand up and stop cowering.

When they can avoid the guns pointed at their heads.

Then they can live or die fighting for their lifes or they can live as cowering slaves and still die.

"And for the support of this Declaration, with a firm reliance on the protection of Divine Providence, we mutually pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes and our sacred Honor."

Thanks, Paul. I was actually coming back to this thread to write those words.

I also wanted to add some words from another great Founding Father: "Fiat Justitia ruat Coelum [Let Justice be done though the heavens should fall]." I interpret those words to mean, do what is right no matter the consequences. In a letter written to his son this Founding Father wrote, "I must think myself independent as long as I live...The feeling is essential to my existence." And lastly when asked to comment on the fiftieth anniversary of the Declaration of Independence he offered "Independence Forever."

Thank you Messrs Adams and Jefferson for choosing to do what was right when you both stood and fought for independence no matter the consequences.

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When are the leaders of these types of companies going to stand up and stop cowering.

When they can avoid the guns pointed at their heads.

Then they can live or die fighting for their lifes or they can live as cowering slaves and still die.

"And for the support of this Declaration, with a firm reliance on the protection of Divine Providence, we mutually pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes and our sacred Honor."

Thanks, Paul. I was actually coming back to this thread to write those words.

I also wanted to add some words from another great Founding Father: "Fiat Justitia ruat Coelum [Let Justice be done though the heavens should fall]." I interpret those words to mean, do what is right no matter the consequences. In a letter written to his son this Founding Father wrote, "I must think myself independent as long as I live...The feeling is essential to my existence." And lastly when asked to comment on the fiftieth anniversary of the Declaration of Independence he offered "Independence Forever."

Thank you Messrs Adams and Jefferson for choosing to do what was right when you both stood and fought for independence no matter the consequences.

Let's not forget my all time favorite, something that every human being should sacredly say, first in silent contemplation, then proclaim to the world:

THESE are the times that try men's souls. The summer soldier and the sunshine patriot will, in this crisis, shrink from the service of their country; but he that stands by it now, deserves the love and thanks of man and woman. Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered; yet we have this consolation with us, that the harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumph.

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A part of our society seems to want to take none of the responsiblity for it's desires and actions, but some how expects all the freedom and wealth that only comes from self responsibility. Idiotic!

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When are the leaders of these types of companies going to stand up and stop cowering.

No time soon, I fear. Corporate America is not a bastion of manhood and courage. But this is hardly news. Read -Atlas Shrugged-.

When these Corporate Birds have had every last feather plucked from them, then they might stand up since they have nothing further to lose.

Bob Kolker

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When are the leaders of these types of companies going to stand up and stop cowering.

No time soon, I fear. Corporate America is not a bastion of manhood and courage. But this is hardly news. Read -Atlas Shrugged-.

When these Corporate Birds have had every last feather plucked from them, then they might stand up since they have nothing further to lose.

Ah, incorrect! Next they'll be made into tasty grilled chicken sandwiches and Buffalo wings. I doubt we'll even hear a faint cry of "But may we please keep our bones?" - they'll give 'em up to make soup stock.

Cowards.

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When are the leaders of these types of companies going to stand up and stop cowering.

When they can avoid the guns pointed at their heads.

Then they can live or die fighting for their lifes or they can live as cowering slaves and still die.

"And for the support of this Declaration, with a firm reliance on the protection of Divine Providence, we mutually pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes and our sacred Honor."

A forced compliance is not a sanction. All of us are forced to comply with many laws that violate our rights, but so long as we advocate the repeal of such laws, our compliance does not constitute a sanction. Unjust laws have to be fought ideologically; they cannot be fought or corrected by means of mere disobedience and futile martyrdom. To quote from an editorial on this subject in the April 1967 issue of Persuasion: "One does not stop the juggernaut by throwing oneself in front of it....")

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When are the leaders of these types of companies going to stand up and stop cowering.

When they can avoid the guns pointed at their heads.

Then they can live or die fighting for their lifes or they can live as cowering slaves and still die.

"And for the support of this Declaration, with a firm reliance on the protection of Divine Providence, we mutually pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes and our sacred Honor."

A forced compliance is not a sanction. All of us are forced to comply with many laws that violate our rights, but so long as we advocate the repeal of such laws, our compliance does not constitute a sanction. Unjust laws have to be fought ideologically; they cannot be fought or corrected by means of mere disobedience and futile martyrdom. To quote from an editorial on this subject in the April 1967 issue of Persuasion: "One does not stop the juggernaut by throwing oneself in front of it....")

I didn't imply that they are sanctioning fascists. I don't regard standing up for rational ideas when threatened by mob rule consists of throwing oneself in front of a juggernaut. The executives may be forced to submit to political pressure. Where is there forced compliance when it comes to defending one's company? These executives from the credit card companies cannot speak up because they share the same morality as those who attack them. Like a trade, sacrifice requires two parties: those collecting and those submitting. In a society with free speech, the only way such a system exists without complaint is by both parties sharing the same morality. And that is the reason the executives "left the White House without talking to reporters."

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A forced compliance is not a sanction. All of us are forced to comply with many laws that violate our rights, but so long as we advocate the repeal of such laws, our compliance does not constitute a sanction. Unjust laws have to be fought ideologically; they cannot be fought or corrected by means of mere disobedience and futile martyrdom. To quote from an editorial on this subject in the April 1967 issue of Persuasion: "One does not stop the juggernaut by throwing oneself in front of it....")

I don't regard standing up for rational ideas when threatened by mob rule consists of throwing oneself in front of a juggernaut. The executives may be forced to submit to political pressure. Where is there forced compliance when it comes to defending one's company?

Look at the banks threatened with "audits" or individuals threatened with IRS investigations.

These executives from the credit card companies cannot speak up because they share the same morality as those who attack them. Like a trade, sacrifice requires two parties: those collecting and those submitting. In a society with free speech, the only way such a system exists without complaint is by both parties sharing the same morality. And that is the reason the executives "left the White House without talking to reporters."

You don't know and I don't know, at this point, what the real reasons were. Given the power of the government and the Obama Administration's determination to have its way, I wouldn't be so quick to condemn the executives until I had more information.

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HERE COMES THE O-CARD

Your Next Credit Card Could Be Backed by Obama

Since apparently everything in America is going into the toilet except the public's faith in Barack Obama, it seems that the way to fix everything in America is to entrust it to Barack Obama. The issues on the table for greater government involvement include: student lending, the car companies, car warranties, pensions, health care, banks, etc -- the list goes on. I mean, really, what's the White House going to back next, your credit card? Maybe, says Slate's Chris Beam.

Beam explains that an Obama card wouldn't be so bizarre in the eyes of other countries. Germany, France, India and Iceland (yikes!) issue cards from state-owned banks. And there's an economic argument, too: If there are quasi-government programs to back house purchases, like Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, why not have a quasi-government program back credit card debt, of which the average American holds $8700?

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"There are some things in life you can't buy. For everything else, there's Obama."

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