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L-C

Greetings

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I'm L-C, resident of Sweden and student of Objectivism. The latter was on and off from 2004 until 2007, when it became more systematic. I've since devoured many, many posts on forums such as CapMag and later Objectivism Online. It was Betsy and Stephen Speicher's posts there that brought this forum to my attention.

Going on 24, I've only recently begun integrating Objectivism into my life, even though I've agreed with it for a good while in principle. Thus, my life is currently heavily "under construction" as I'm doing my best to determine what my career should be. I'm currently studying Computer Science since video/computer gaming is what I've done most of my life. Not sure if it's the way to go for me (author is another career I've toyed with), but effort and reason are what I can offer in order to find out, and those are the things I will use.

The state (so to speak) of Sweden and whether to move or stay is another big issue. There are compelling arguments for both. Increasingly, the scales tip toward the US...

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Welcome! If you don't mind, can you write a few paragraphs on the state of socialism in Sweden. In the US, Sweden is always held up as an example of how socialism at its best.

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Welcome to the Forum, L-C! Looking forward to hearing from you.

Good question, stay or go. The U.S., despite its current beleaguered status, adminsitratively speaking, is still the freest country, but our President is vying with great energy for Third-World status. Sweden may be a model Socialist country, but he seems to enjoy the company of more aggressive leadership, like Hugo Chavez, Ahmedinejad, or Raul Castro.

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Thanks.

jordanz and alann: I can list some of my reasons for wanting to move to the US: I want the right to defend my life, health and property from violent crime. I want to pay less than 50% income tax, 25% sales tax, 125% gas tax etc. I don't want to be a stranger in a strange land when it comes to Objectivism.

Your current president is one of the worst yet but at least you have an ideal to fight for, and a laundry list of freedoms not available here.

Also, Europe and especially Sweden are quickly moving toward a future as a caliphate. It's fast. A generation from now, Islam will have increased its influence here a couple of orders of magnitude since the early 90's.

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jordanz and alann: I can list some of my reasons for wanting to move to the US: I want the right to defend my life, health and property from violent crime. I want to pay less than 50% income tax, 25% sales tax, 125% gas tax etc. I don't want to be a stranger in a strange land when it comes to Objectivism.

Make sure you pick the right state. Don't come to California. Combined with Federal tax and California tax, we can be close to 40%. We have near 10% sales tax too.

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I was thinking Delaware or New Hampshire.

Well, you'll feel at home with the weather in those states :P

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Move!

As a migrant from another socialist country (France) I can tell you it's worth it. I don't know what Sweden is like, but based on my experiences in other EU countries (UK, Spain, Italy, Germany, Austria, Switzerland, CZ, Portugal), one unexpected trade-off will be in infrastructure (from power sockets to roads), which is much, much poorer in the States. There are many other trade-offs which I wasn't prepared for (sometimes New York reminds me of Mumbai, and not in a good way - let's just say coming to the US helped me understand why the more civilized parts of India are like they are) but they are worth coping with, because the American spirit is more precious than any material comforts, and because you can easily buy your way to a more comfortable life anyway. Absolute tax rates are not as important, imho - for example, you could get great rates in Zurich, Zug or Oberwald, but the Swiss (in my limited experience) do not have anywhere near the same energy and drive that makes America such an enjoyable place to live, despite being very decent people when it comes to individual rights and defending them (12yo assault rifle contests.. that's what I'm talking about!). Similarly, HK and Singapore are possibly the cheapest places to be right now, but do you really want to live in Asia for the rest of your life?

What you should do is give it a try. I'd recommend SoCal over SF, because it's less communist (sorry to any SF members of the forum but those of your neighbours I have met were not particularly encouraging!) and has a thriving IT/tech startup industry, where you could easily go and negotiate a couple of months' internship (for free if necessary).

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I was thinking Delaware or New Hampshire.

Well, you'll feel at home with the weather in those states :P

Haha, what I was thinking!

The best part of being in the US is that you can have both free markets AND sun...

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Well, I find our weather too warm most of the time. California has some interesting business but I desire the right to self defense and gun ownership (including CCW) which is not well protected there. Self defense is extremely persecuted, prohibited and punished in Sweden so it's a bit of a priority for me.

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. . .

The best part of being in the US is that you can have both free markets AND sun...

I am currently living in Portland, Oregon. What is this sun of which you speak?

(for that matter, by 'free market' I assume you meant 'flea market'? The free market is reserved for new areas of enterprise the gov't hasn't yet figured out how to regulate. It's a transitional state in our current economy. Either that or I am suffering from Seasonal Affective Disorder due to absence of aforementioned sun)

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. . .

The best part of being in the US is that you can have both free markets AND sun...

I am currently living in Portland, Oregon. What is this sun of which you speak?

(for that matter, by 'free market' I assume you meant 'flea market'? The free market is reserved for new areas of enterprise the gov't hasn't yet figured out how to regulate. It's a transitional state in our current economy. Either that or I am suffering from Seasonal Affective Disorder due to absence of aforementioned sun)

Reword for precision: you can have a combination of something more closely approaching conditions in which entrepreneurship is financially rewarded and only moderately inhibited by legislative brakes (aka looters), and (in some areas) solar exposure sufficient to turn your skin red if you stay out for a couple of hours, for at least 6 months in a year :P

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Hello and welcome to THE FORUM, L-C. I am a relatively new member myself.

Make sure you pick the right state. Don't come to California. Combined with Federal tax and California tax, we can be close to 40%. We have near 10% sales tax too.

Not to hijack L-C's thread but, out of curiosity, what are the top 3 (or more) states you would pick as most closely resembling a free society?

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