Miheer

Introduction

23 posts in this topic

Hello all,

I am Miheer, nineteen years old, a student of Mechanical engineering from Mumbai, India. I came across this forum while searching for Ayn Rand communities on the web.

I was introduced to Ayn Rand when I was 17, after Class XII when my father handed me 'We The Living'. Subsequently I have read almost all of Rand's fiction. Her essays in 'The Virtue of Selfishness' & 'Capitalism: The Unknown Ideal' have influenced me most powerfully. Indeed social & economic conditions in India being EXACTLY the same as that described in Atlas Shrugged, I was desperate to find like-minded people with whom I could talk sense. Presently almost no-one around me except my father understands/ accepts Rand's views or rather reason as the most important aspect of life.

I am very much looking forward to interacting with people in this forum.

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Hello all,

I am Miheer, nineteen years old, a student of Mechanical engineering from Mumbai, India. I came across this forum while searching for Ayn Rand communities on the web.

I was introduced to Ayn Rand when I was 17, after Class XII when my father handed me 'We The Living'. Subsequently I have read almost all of Rand's fiction. Her essays in 'The Virtue of Selfishness' & 'Capitalism: The Unknown Ideal' have influenced me most powerfully. Indeed social & economic conditions in India being EXACTLY the same as that described in Atlas Shrugged, I was desperate to find like-minded people with whom I could talk sense. Presently almost no-one around me except my father understands/ accepts Rand's views or rather reason as the most important aspect of life.

I am very much looking forward to interacting with people in this forum.

Welcome! It's wonderful to have a new member, especially one who is both relatively new to Objectivism and who lives in one of the most fascinating countries in the world today.

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I am very much looking forward to interacting with people in this forum.
Great to have you here, Miheer!

Looking forward to your contributions.

India seems a very mixed bag, from the stories of my friends from over there. A lot of good things in terms of technical education and development, a more productive Western orientation than many 3rd-world countries, but a lot of State corruption and religious squabbling, zealotry, and bigotry. But I've heard their are Objectivists over there. There certainly are some brilliant Capitalists in or from India.

Welcome!

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Hello all,

I am Miheer, nineteen years old, a student of Mechanical engineering from Mumbai, India. I came across this forum while searching for Ayn Rand communities on the web.

I was introduced to Ayn Rand when I was 17, after Class XII when my father handed me 'We The Living'. Subsequently I have read almost all of Rand's fiction. Her essays in 'The Virtue of Selfishness' & 'Capitalism: The Unknown Ideal' have influenced me most powerfully. Indeed social & economic conditions in India being EXACTLY the same as that described in Atlas Shrugged, I was desperate to find like-minded people with whom I could talk sense. Presently almost no-one around me except my father understands/ accepts Rand's views or rather reason as the most important aspect of life.

I am very much looking forward to interacting with people in this forum.

Welcome! I'm relatively new too, but it is a nice forum. Have a good time!

Over here in America, I here a lot about how India's conditions are due to a right-wing government allowing businessmen to pillage the land. Is that at all true?

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I am very much looking forward to interacting with people in this forum.
Great to have you here, Miheer!

Looking forward to your contributions.

India seems a very mixed bag, from the stories of my friends from over there. A lot of good things in terms of technical education and development, a more productive Western orientation than many 3rd-world countries, but a lot of State corruption and religious squabbling, zealotry, and bigotry. But I've heard their are Objectivists over there. There certainly are some brilliant Capitalists in or from India.

Welcome!

One should not consider success of a capitalist in mixed economies like India to be a measure of his brilliance alone because the 'aristocracy of pull' calls the shots in many deals & laws (although there are exceptions). Technical education till undergraduate level is good in the IITs (I study in IIT Bombay), & it is said that the level of high school courses is better than that in U.S. So, Indians who emigrate to Western countries in search of a better life(job or higher education) are seen to thrive & succeed in their careers. Corruption is rampant, politics is governed by religious sentiments & the Hindu caste system still has a strong hold implicitly.

The Indian society is westernizing; but very ungratefully, Western societies (including Britain which made us a relatively civilized nation & U.S. in particular) are held as greedy capitalists who are evil & without any culture.

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I look forward to more of your views on where you live. Good to have you here.

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Welcome to the Forum. It would be very interesting to many of us if you could describe what your education has been like there, both in your specialty of ME and more generally: the courses you have taken, how they are taught, etc.

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Hi Miheer, welcome to the forum. I'm nineteen and majoring in engineering as well, though my degree is in marine engineering and naval architecture. I second ewv request. I would be very interested to see what your education is like. I personally feel like I learned almost nothing in high school, especially in the fundamentals of math and physics.

I hope you'll find this forum interesting and exciting. Sadly, because of school, I don't have much time for it anymore.

Zak

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Welcome Miheer,

I have had the good fortune to visit Mumbai on several occasions. I have found India to be experiencing a renaissance. There is great energy and optimism for the future. It is this optimism in the people I have met that excites me. They have a genuine interest in ideas that is uncommon in America outside of forums like this. Real change happens when the values of the people change, this occurs long before changes to government bureaucracy. I see the seeds of great things in India.

I’m looking forward to your perspective.

Roger

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@ ewv & realitycheck44

Educational system here :

1 yr nursery(optional)

2 yr kindergarten - starts around 4 yrs of age.

10 yr school

2 yr Jr. College

3 or 4 yr Bachelor degree - graduation

~ 2 yr Masters degree - post graduation

~ 4 yr Ph.D

For doctors the process is different & lengthy timewise.

I think the educational system is the same as that introduced by Thomas Macaulay during British rule. Education in a very few schools with dedicated teachers is exceptionally good, while in villages it is a joke.

Currently I have finished 2 years of B.Tech (Bachelor of Technology) in IIT Bombay in Mechanical engg & 2 years remain. We have specializations in Design, Manufacturing & Thermal/Fluids. Till now we have done courses on Fluid Mech, thermodynamics, Heat Transfer, Workshop, Measurement & Strength of Maherials (which is i think well-known & feared as Applied Mechanics) & inro to elec engg, materials science. There are also compulsory courses in humanities & social sciences. Basically, we copy the system in colleges like MIT in IIT.

Many states have their own education boards which are generally inferior to the Central board (CBSE) & ICSE. Assessment judges predominantly learning by rote.

However competitive exams in Math, General Sciences & Social Sciences held in various subjects by independent boards make up for the inadequacies in education (this is true in my state - Maharashtra). Intelligent & hard-working students who have an aptitude in math/science go to IITs after their Jr. college. This is through a special (touted as one of the most difficult in the world) entrance exam called IIT-JEE.

There are also excellent institutes for management - IIMs. The IITs & IIMs are among the very few places in India where 'things work as they ought to'.

Though I have watched many American movies (like American Pie for instance), I am still not clear about the educational system in the U.S. & the age at which you people finish high school/ college, the no of years spent in each stage etc. Will be great if someone could clarify.

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Welcome Miheer,

I have had the good fortune to visit Mumbai on several occasions. I have found India to be experiencing a renaissance. There is great energy and optimism for the future. It is this optimism in the people I have met that excites me. They have a genuine interest in ideas that is uncommon in America outside of forums like this. Real change happens when the values of the people change, this occurs long before changes to government bureaucracy. I see the seeds of great things in India.

I’m looking forward to your perspective.

Roger

Mumbai is the best city of India in every aspect, including the kind of professionals you would have interacted with. There is semi-rational atmosphere here.

I think that the state of Maharashtra & a few cities like Bangalore are like the state of Colorado (mentioned in Atlas Shrugged).

Yes, there is great energy & optimism after liberalization of economy forced by World Bank et al in the 1990s. The IT-ITeS-BPO-KPO industries are booming (raising a hue & cry in the U.S. about native jobs lost). I saw a Russell Peters comedy show video wherein he says that Indians are happy to slog for hours just for a sandwich. Life is relatively better off than during the 1980s; my dad says that they were required to apply for a government license even to own a radio set!!

Basically India is an emerging economy & industries that become obsolete/ infeasible in developed countries, like IT, paper, textiles, automobile manufacturing etc. start booming in India.

However as I said earlier, though our economy has benefited so much from the U.S., though Indian kids long to settle in the U.S, the Americans are still regarded as immoral people with a corrupt culture. The 'germ-eaten hovels by the Ganges'(Atlas Shrugged) are still considered morally superior to the skyscrapers of New York.

As far as high-end research etc is concerned we are nowhere.

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This reminds me of a conversation I had with an Indian engineering student who was in one of my classes. We were talking, before class started, about whether or not the Indian government should limit food exports because of some supposed price increase for foodstuffs in India because foreigners are willing to pay more for the food than their own citizens. He was, of course, for this regulation. I tried to explain to him that if you limit foreign trade the demand for food will drop and they will end up producing less food leaving them in the same if not a worst position. I said the only way you get around this was for the government to mandate a certain amount of production and as we have seen government regulation has never worked. I also noted that this reduces a man down to the level of a slave. I asked if he thought it was alright to do this and he, of course, said yes, claiming that I am looking at only as a capitalist and that there is a social element to consider. There seems to be this striking contradiction in Indian culture and I have observed it in nearly every Indian I have met that was not born and raised in the United States. To say nothing of that bizarre religion, Hinduism, that makes post-enlightenment Christianity look completely rational!

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My view of India may be somewhat rosy. I have experienced it through the eyes of other IIT graduates who wanted me to know the very best of what India had to offer. Still, I run a team of about 15 developers in Puna, and I find their bright hope for the future inspiring. They lack the cynicism common in the US.

I recognize the accomplishment of being a student at IIT. I understand that admittance to IIT is only achieved by the very best of the best of the best. It is like MIT, only harder to gain admittance. The IIT grads I have met have accomplished great things.

However as I said earlier, though our economy has benefited so much from the U.S., though Indian kids long to settle in the U.S, the Americans are still regarded as immoral people with a corrupt culture. The 'germ-eaten hovels by the Ganges'(Atlas Shrugged) are still considered morally superior to the skyscrapers of New York.

Sadly, too many Americans agree with your country men. While they are content to enjoy the benefits of industrialization, they still proclaim the virtues of worm-eaten hovels; particularly as it pertains to the environment.

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Welcome to the Forum :D.

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We have specializations in Design, Manufacturing & Thermal/Fluids. Till now we have done courses on Fluid Mech, thermodynamics, Heat Transfer, Workshop, Measurement & Strength of Maherials (which is i think well-known & feared as Applied Mechanics) & inro to elec engg, materials science. There are also compulsory courses in humanities & social sciences. Basically, we copy the system in colleges like MIT in IIT.

Applied mechanics is a very mathematical and interesting subject that should not be feared.

I am still not clear about the educational system in the U.S. & the age at which you people finish high school/ college, the no of years spent in each stage etc. Will be great if someone could clarify.

It is very similar to what you have. There may be a 'nursery school', then one year of kindergarten, then 12 years in a local public town or city high school with graduation at the age of 17 or 18, then 4 years of college before graduate school with a masters degree and perhaps then a PhD.

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Thank you all for such enthusiastic reception.

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Miheer, my vague recollection is that IIT students get practicum/field placements in a business. Is that still the case? I'm wondering whether you seek the placement yourself, or whether the school chooses one for you, based on some criteria, from a list of businesses that submit their companies as interested in having an intern.

I'm not sure what you mean by "high-end research". Do Motorola and Cisco (just to name a couple of dozens, including pharmaceuticals) not have research facilities in Maharastra? I am certain the facilities are not in the Punjab. And I believe IIT Bombay has its research fellow and summer internship scheme that is heavily competed for, does it not?

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Miheer, my vague recollection is that IIT students get practicum/field placements in a business. Is that still the case? I'm wondering whether you seek the placement yourself, or whether the school chooses one for you, based on some criteria, from a list of businesses that submit their companies as interested in having an intern.

I'm not sure what you mean by "high-end research". Do Motorola and Cisco (just to name a couple of dozens, including pharmaceuticals) not have research facilities in Maharastra? I am certain the facilities are not in the Punjab. And I believe IIT Bombay has its research fellow and summer internship scheme that is heavily competed for, does it not?

We have a compulsory 3 month internship to be completed during vacation after 3rd year. Applications have to be sent to companies/universities by students themselves. However students who do not get accepted anywhere are placed by the institute.

By high end research, I mean research at the frontiers of science & technology. I don't think any US co. has 'research' facilities in India. Work & not research is outsourced to India.

IIT-B's intern programs are heavily competed for by the other engineering colleges in India. IITians strive for internships & higher stdies in Europe/USA.

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By high end research, I mean research at the frontiers of science & technology. I don't think any US co. has 'research' facilities in India. Work & not research is outsourced to India.

Well, Motorola does have research facilities in India, but then what isn't in Bangalore. Merck and Eli Lilly have clinical research ongoing in facilities there. I don't think many America college students haven't any idea of the competitive secondary school and college atmosphere there, and I am optimistic India will produce true competitors against U.S. companies, products and business innovations when individuals' technical capabilities are compartmentalized from the anti-Western cultural sneering.

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There is no denying the fact that Indian scientists are extremely talented. However, innovations done in India by Indians working for American or other multinational cos. will be patented in the US.

I think that the strength of intellectual property laws in a country is a measure of the amount & level of research that is undertaken. In India the concept of IPR is just taking birth. I know this for a fact that in the realm of engineering, original ideas of individuals/ a co., if discovered by another co. , are unscrupulously copied without any compensation.

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