ruveyn ben yosef

Staying Young and Beautiful

36 posts in this topic

Don't you think all this is kind of superficial?

If we live long enough we are going to end up looking dreadful. And our outward appearance does not necessarily reflect the inner being.

ruveyn

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lol, of course it's not what really matters. But one of the great things about this world, as my Profession shows clearly, is beauty. So there is absolutely nothing wrong with sharing pictures on whom we think is beautiful. It is a Value.

Yes, unfortunately age will cause us to not look our best, but I think that is all the more reason to admire beauty. I love pictures of myself during my youth, because I appreciate my youth. But as much as I appreciate my youth, I know that what will last until I die, and what is most important is my active thinking mind, my character and, my love for living.

Superficial is when you judge a persons worth and only focus on their appearance, which is accidental.

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Don't you think all this is kind of superficial?

Not ALL of it. Objectivism is all for mind-body integration. Appearance alone isn't significant, but then, neither are just mental accomplisments. How about a beautiful mind in a beautiful body -- as beautiful of each as it is in your power to achieve?

If we live long enough we are going to end up looking dreadful. And our outward appearance does not necessarily reflect the inner being.

Actually, it usually does, because the mind controls and shapes the body. Katharine Hepburn was beautiful in her twenties and in her eighties. The beauty of youth is fairly easy, but the beauty of advanced age is a real accomplishment.

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Don't you think all this is kind of superficial?

If we were all ghosts in the shell, nothing but spirit trapped in material form -- then yes, beauty would not matter.

Beautiful women are a wonder to behold and a joy to see every day. I wouldn't want to live in a world where they didn't care about their appearance.

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Don't you think all this is kind of superficial?

If we live long enough we are going to end up looking dreadful. And our outward appearance does not necessarily reflect the inner being.

ruveyn

I have seen very old people who are beautiful, but the beauty of mature and healthy men and women is a gladness to my spirit. In admiring their beauty I celebrate the essential youthfulness of my judging, creative mind. We are all "going to end up" dead, but that does not mean that living is superficial.

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Don't you think all this is kind of superficial?

No.

If we live long enough we are going to end up looking dreadful.

And roses and peonies and other flowers that live long enough are going to wilt and turn brown and die, therefore we should not enjoy appreciate their beauty while they are still young and healthy?

Also, as I have already indicated on another thread, you can dismiss the growing possibility of anti-aging technology all you want, but one of its countless implications is that men and women will not need to look increasingly disintegrated as they age precisely because the damage that it reflects will be repaired or prevented. The human body is a machine and it can be repaired indefinitely just like any other machine, the repair process is simply not yet fully known.

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To expand a bit on my last post: not only is the beauty commonly associated with the youthful, healthy body *not* superficial, it represents an ideal state for our physical existence, one that *ought* to provide additional motivation to discover ways to reverse and halt the visible damage that distinguishes the 20 year old from the 90 year old.

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Don't you think all this is kind of superficial?

No.

If we live long enough we are going to end up looking dreadful.

And roses and peonies and other flowers that live long enough are going to wilt and turn brown and die, therefore we should not enjoy appreciate their beauty while they are still young and healthy?

Also, as I have already indicated on another thread, you can dismiss the growing possibility of anti-aging technology all you want, but one of its countless implications is that men and women will not need to look increasingly disintegrated as they age precisely because the damage that it reflects will be repaired or prevented. The human body is a machine and it can be repaired indefinitely just like any other machine, the repair process is simply not yet fully known.

I will stop dismissing it when -I see it-. I am interested in -results- not mere hope or promise of results. Eternal youth or eternal life has been promised for thousands of years and never once delivered. If someone promised you the Brooklyn Bridge as your very own, would you buy it?

Also I am very skeptical of something that violates the second law of thermodynamics. All repair modalities increase the total amount of entropy in the universe and decrease it only locally where there is a source of high grade energy. We -cannot- live forever. I have no doubt that life expectancy with good health will be increased in the coming years, but that increase will not be unlimited. I really doubt whether all the technology in this sector of the galaxy could increase our healthy lifetime to say a thousand years. Thermodynamics aside, the more stringent limit is the information capacity of our brains. If we live long enough we will run out of room to store stuff in our heads and we will have to dump some of it. Since there is not even the whiff of a hint on storing our memories (as such) on any kind of persistent medium it will be dumped into the null file. Most of what we remember and recall is non-verbal so keeping a diary is of limited utility.

Fati, Fati, non parole (Deeds, Deeds, not words). I want RESULTS, not promises.

ruveyn

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There is another element to physical beauty that I enjoy and that is the man or woman who MAKES THE MOST OF what they have physically. The vast majority of men and women must make an effort to be attractive looking, and even the naturally beautiful must make an effort to retain and refine it. For example, a beautiful woman wears make-up that compliments her already pretty face or a handsome man keeps himself well groomed and dresses in a way to enhance his natural assets.

I have noticed men and women in Sydney look much better than men and women in many American cities. One could say Aussies are naturally more attractive physically, but I think it has more to do with the care they take in presenting themselves. Personally I notice shoes and Australian men actually are good at picking nice shoes, unlike American men. Nice shoes on an American man are often a sign he's gay, amusingly enough, but in Australia, a stylish looking man is not at all indicative of his sexual orientation.

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Also I am very skeptical of something that violates the second law of thermodynamics. All repair modalities increase the total amount of entropy in the universe and decrease it only locally where there is a source of high grade energy. We -cannot- live forever.

You are more intelligent than to equate life extension with immortality so kindly stop referring to that ridiculous nonsense, it has absolutely zero bearing on the issue. None whatsoever.

I have no doubt that life expectancy with good health will be increased in the coming years, but that increase will not be unlimited. I really doubt whether all the technology in this sector of the galaxy could increase our healthy lifetime to say a thousand years.

A thousand years ago, virtually every technology that exists today was not even imaginable. It would look like literal magic. That is *nothing* compared to progress over the next thousand years, which is growing from the current base.

Thermodynamics aside,

Yes, let's. The universe is not running out of steam anytime in the next 10 billion years.

the more stringent limit is the information capacity of our brains. If we live long enough we will run out of room to store stuff in our heads and we will have to dump some of it. Since there is not even the whiff of a hint on storing our memories (as such) on any kind of persistent medium it will be dumped into the null file. Most of what we remember and recall is non-verbal so keeping a diary is of limited utility.

Nobody really knows what the storage capacity is of the brain. Even within our currently limited lifetimes, we forget many things, often things that are not particularly interesting or relevant. That's bad? In any case, the advance of knowledge is not a linear progression in one narrow field. It occurs on many fronts simultaneously. While I agree that brain related issues are going to be the toughest to handle, I disagree that they will be *impossible* to handle. Technology to improve brain functioning and intelligence is eventually going to be part of the package, with extremely non-linearly productive results given the power of increased intelligence to solve further problems (including further boosting of intelligence.)

Fati, Fati, non parole (Deeds, Deeds, not words). I want RESULTS, not promises.

I didn't want to say this before, but serious anti-aging technology is probably not going to be available in your lifetime (though I wouldn't say the probability is zero either.) Sorry, but get over it. That has nothing to do with objectively assessing the technology and its prospects, and whether it can personally help you or not in the next 5 or 10 years is not the point of discussing it.

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Fati, Fati, non parole (Deeds, Deeds, not words). I want RESULTS, not promises.

I, along with some others, have given you a lot of "RESULTS" that you seem to keep discarding without any attempt to implement or understand. Instead of waiting around for someone else to "verify" the information I would recommend you attempt to "verify" it yourself.

Back to the subject. We love beautiful paintings, sculptures and more, why can we not love and celebrate the beauty of a human? I agree with some of the other posters, in that beauty in youth is usually simple, but still worthy of praise. Beauty in the aged is something that requires work and more importantly self-esteem. There is something special about seeing an aged man or woman that carries themselves with a walk that matches their beauty.

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Not only do I think it is not superficial at all to appreciate beauty in itself, but that path leads to a lot of unearned guilt as you try unsuccessfully to block the thoughts. For crying out loud, looking at a beautiful woman isn't the same as sleeping with her.

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Nobody really knows what the storage capacity is of the brain. Even within our currently limited lifetimes, we forget many things, often things that are not particularly interesting or relevant. That's bad? In any case, the advance of knowledge is not a linear progression in one narrow field. It occurs on many fronts simultaneously. While I agree that brain related issues are going to be the toughest to handle, I disagree that they will be *impossible* to handle. Technology to improve brain functioning and intelligence is eventually going to be part of the package, with extremely non-linearly productive results given the power of increased intelligence to solve further problems (including further boosting of intelligence.)

And honestly, who wouldn't rather deal with knowing too much than dying of a heart attack? With every advancement in the human lifespan, there are new challenges. For example, one reason heart disease is so much more common in the West than in the Third World is that we actually live long enough for the condition to develop. I'm sure there will be more than just memory limits to deal with, but that is no reason to discard the benefits of living longer.

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If we live long enough we are going to end up looking dreadful.

Also, as I have already indicated on another thread, you can dismiss the growing possibility of anti-aging technology all you want, but one of its countless implications is that men and women will not need to look increasingly disintegrated as they age precisely because the damage that it reflects will be repaired or prevented. The human body is a machine and it can be repaired indefinitely just like any other machine, the repair process is simply not yet fully known.

Fati, Fati, non parole (Deeds, Deeds, not words). I want RESULTS, not promises.

How's this?

9dd07367628eef76b3b9f8e8edeec4f84g.jpg

And this.

dbd59a005807920d5086dc9f0f2551364g.jpg

Those pictures of me were taken in the past couple of months and I also have a state-of-the-art video of my heart and coronaries arteries in action that looks like the heart of a healthy teenage athlete.

For the past year, a major project has been Betsy's Mid-Life Makeover ™ to improve my health and appearance using leading edge research and technology. I may not live forever, but my goal is to beat the record set by my mother's Aunt Jenny (102) and Aunt Dora (107).

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I have said so before but I will just repeat that you look fantastic, Betsy!

to improve my health and appearance using leading edge research and technology.

Care to share your secrets?

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to improve my health and appearance using leading edge research and technology.

Care to share your secrets?

No secrets, really. I've already mentioned doing resistance weight training similar to RayK's Progressive Exercise. That has increased my lean muscle mass and decreased body fat. It also has had a beneficial effect on my metabolic functioning and improved my levels and processing of insulin, leptin, ghrelin, and adiponectin. I have also improved my metabolic profile with large doses of Omega-3 (especially EPA), estrogen replacement, lipo'ing some belly fat, and getting more sleep. I haven't been dieting at all, but what I crave has changed from large portions of comforting carbs to meat, fish, nuts, fruits, and veggies.

I was considering a face lift or brow lift, but was afraid of looking like Joan Rivers or Nancy Pelosi, so I did further research and found out about Dr. Mark Berman. Dr. Berman did an innovative procedure he calls a "Space Lift" (here) that returned my face to its earlier natural contours. I also had some dental work and updated my hair style, make-up, and wardrobe.

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to improve my health and appearance using leading edge research and technology.

Care to share your secrets?

No secrets, really. I've already mentioned doing resistance weight training similar to RayK's Progressive Exercise. That has increased my lean muscle mass and decreased body fat. It also has had a beneficial effect on my metabolic functioning and improved my levels and processing of insulin, leptin, ghrelin, and adiponectin. I have also improved my metabolic profile with large doses of Omega-3 (especially EPA), estrogen replacement, lipo'ing some belly fat, and getting more sleep. I haven't been dieting at all, but what I crave has changed from large portions of comforting carbs to meat, fish, nuts, fruits, and veggies.

I was considering a face lift or brow lift, but was afraid of looking like Joan Rivers or Nancy Pelosi, so I did further research and found out about Dr. Mark Berman. Dr. Berman did an innovative procedure he calls a "Space Lift" (here) that returned my face to its earlier natural contours. I also had some dental work and updated my hair style, make-up, and wardrobe.

Good for you, Betsy. You look fantastic!

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I completely agree, that's a lot of work and it really paid off. :huh:

Betsy's specifics are an illustration of my points in another thread. Betsy is a naturally attractive woman, I think, but she has made the effort to look and be her best.

I am lucky to be extremely young looking naturally (thanks Mom and Dad!), but even I had to make the effort some years ago to lose some weight and get in better shape. I also made a conscious decision to update my look. I found that my confidence level increased and people noticed.

Naturally I have Betsy to thank in an indirect way. Since I've known her, she has offered sage but gentle advice on how to go about improving myself. Of course, Stephen was excellent at this, too.

I raise my glass to our lovely moderator!

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If we live long enough we are going to end up looking dreadful. And our outward appearance does not necessarily reflect the inner being.

Actually, it usually does, because the mind controls and shapes the body. Katharine Hepburn was beautiful in her twenties and in her eighties. The beauty of youth is fairly easy, but the beauty of advanced age is a real accomplishment.

I agree. For example, Johnny Depp is aging really beautifully, I almost can't wait until he is sixty. :huh:

Jose.

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Yes, Betsy you do look lovely. I had noticed it when you changed your avatar some time ago but the picture of your torso and the close up confirms my initial note. Quite inspiring.

Jose.

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If we live long enough we are going to end up looking dreadful.

Also, as I have already indicated on another thread, you can dismiss the growing possibility of anti-aging technology all you want, but one of its countless implications is that men and women will not need to look increasingly disintegrated as they age precisely because the damage that it reflects will be repaired or prevented. The human body is a machine and it can be repaired indefinitely just like any other machine, the repair process is simply not yet fully known.

Fati, Fati, non parole (Deeds, Deeds, not words). I want RESULTS, not promises.

How's this?

9dd07367628eef76b3b9f8e8edeec4f84g.jpg

And this.

dbd59a005807920d5086dc9f0f2551364g.jpg

Those pictures of me were taken in the past couple of months and I also have a state-of-the-art video of my heart and coronaries arteries in action that looks like the heart of a healthy teenage athlete.

For the past year, a major project has been Betsy's Mid-Life Makeover to improve my health and appearance using leading edge research and technology. I may not live forever, but my goal is to beat the record set by my mother's Aunt Jenny (102) and Aunt Dora (107).

Beautiful woman who pleases eyes to see,

Long-lasting youth paints every part of thee.

Thy face of light, so very clear and bold,

Makes Age himself think he was never old,

And Form of Body, seeing yours divine,

Has left abstraction for your perfect line.

Plato himself would from his shadows steal

To fix his eyes with your ideal real.

Philosophy, of years has naught to say,

But could he say it, it's "Betsy's made my day!"

Now have good cheer, and with new-muscled might

Give every thought a more impetuous flight.

The date of Youth has not yet met his end

When such a woman Time's quick glances send.

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I will stop dismissing it when -I see it-. I am interested in -results- not mere hope or promise of results.

But there is enough proof of Man's capacities for you not to dismiss the idea of immortality as some sort of fantasy.

I have no doubt that life expectancy with good health will be increased in the coming years, but that increase will not be unlimited.

Don't you shift context when you refer to the Second Law in this way?

I really doubt whether all the technology in this sector of the galaxy could increase our healthy lifetime to say a thousand years.

Then let's move to the sectors with the technology that can do it!

:huh:

Thermodynamics aside, the more stringent limit is the information capacity of our brains. If we live long enough we will run out of room to store stuff in our heads and we will have to dump some of it. Since there is not even the whiff of a hint on storing our memories (as such) on any kind of persistent medium it will be dumped into the null file. Most of what we remember and recall is non-verbal so keeping a diary is of limited utility.

Even if all of this is true: So what? How did you conclude that none of these limitations can be overcome?

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Don't you think all this is kind of superficial?

If we live long enough we are going to end up looking dreadful. And our outward appearance does not necessarily reflect the inner being.

ruveyn

I have seen very old people who are beautiful, but the beauty of mature and healthy men and women is a gladness to my spirit. In admiring their beauty I celebrate the essential youthfulness of my judging, creative mind. We are all "going to end up" dead, but that does not mean that living is superficial.

Living/Dying is real. How we look, to a degree is superficial. Beauty fades or (if you are a Romantic) beauty transforms from the beauty of youth the the beauty of graceful and proper againg.

I have seen the tail end since I live in a retirement community. The running joke is that our community is God's waiting room We walk in and are eventually carried out.

I am just a "kid" here. Many of the elderly are in their 80's a fewer in their 90's and we had one celebrate has 102nd birthday (mazel tov to him!). Some of the golden oldies look very good for their age. They are spry, mentally sharp and can still play a mean game of tennis. Some of them, especially the women, are suffering from osteoperosis. The spine hardens and bends. There really is no cure and calcium maintainance can only go so far to prevent it. About one third of the octagenarians need walkers or crutches or canes to get about. Two thirds are still able to move reasonably which cheers me up no end, since I am an habitual walker and bike rider.

Some of the Old Guys are veterans of WW2. I look at the History Channel and see the documentaries which show soldiers in the vigor of youth, well muscled, fleet of foot, quick of hand and sharp-eyed. Some of these very people live next door to me. The contrast is their. One of the Golden Oldies was on Utah Beach. Now he walks about pretty well (for someone in his 80s) but he will no longer run up the sand and tote a rifle. That is life. If nothing else, life is change. What is history for me, is memory for him.

Beauty fades eventually. So it goes. If we are fortunate we will get to our 80s or 90s in reasonably good health, with our wits and memory intact and then be snuffed quickly when the time comes and not suffer senility or physical disability. For those unfortunates who are going out hard, the last year or two is not pleasant. I hope I am spared that pain, but I won't know that until I get there.

ruveyn

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