The King Of Handguns

[Paul's Here 0]

I was just watching a show on National Geographic and a segment was on the Most Powerful Handgun Ever Made. It is the Smith & Wesson model 500 50-caliber Magnum. The massive 50 caliber bullet is the largest legal round that can be fired from a handgun. It is a wonderful feat of engineering. The entire frame had to be redesigned because of the huge pressures generated during firing.

The S&W X-frame Model 500 is a brawny handgun designed to master the most rigorous hunting fields in the world. It is not a revolver one would, or likely could, tuck into a waistband. In fact, to call it massive is an understatement.

With its 8-3/8-in. barrel, the overall length of the Model 500 is 15 in. and the empty weight is 4.5 pounds. The cylinder alone is almost 2 in. in diameter and approaches 2.25 in. in length. Thumb the cylinder open and five charge holes await. Each is 1/2 in. in diameter, and the .50-cal. cartridges they hold are almost 2 in. long. Load five of them and the total weight of the handgun climbs to 5 pounds.

You don't just casually pick up a Model 500. You have to lift it.

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When the .44 Magnum laid claim to being the most powerful handgun in the world, its standard load produced about 900 ft.-lb. of muzzle energy. Several new loads have since eclipsed that, but the handgun most commonly used by big game hunters is the .454 Casull, which will generate about 1900 ft.-lb.

The 500 S&W Magnum will produce almost 2600 ft.-lb. with its heaviest load, and more powerful loads may well be on the way.

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One of the more unusual aspects of the Model 500's creation is that S&W developed the cartridge first. Only when the gunsmiths had the performance levels they wanted, did they design and build the revolver that would fire it.

Looks like we need a new Dirty Harry sequel.

[RayK 0]

During my life I have shot all sorts of handguns, rifles, grenade launchers, anti-tank weapons and many more items. I have shot the .50 cal hand held sniper rifle and the .50 cal machine gun of which both are very powerful. With the .50 cal machine gun we could blow through trees, concrete walls and more to get to the enemy, if needed. It is an amazing site to see this powerful gun/rifle destroy one's enemy forces to just pebbles, I loved it. I have also shot the .44 Magnum with one hand, once, and the kick almost caused me to hit my head with the gun. We used to set up watermelons and from about 50 yards blow them to pieces, it really can blow one's head "clean off." But, as of yet, I have never shot a .50 cal pistol and can only imagine what type of fire power this gun must have.

Here is a link that shows the sizes of different rounds. The round on the left is, obviously, the .50 cal and the one second from the right is a 5.56 mm round that is fired in an M16A2 service rifle, the primary rifle of the Marine Corps.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.50_BMG

[Paul's Here 0]

During my life I have shot all sorts of handguns, rifles, grenade launchers, anti-tank weapons and many more items. I have shot the .50 cal hand held sniper rifle and the .50 cal machine gun of which both are very powerful. With the .50 cal machine gun we could blow through trees, concrete walls and more to get to the enemy, if needed. It is an amazing site to see this powerful gun/rifle destroy one's enemy forces to just pebbles, I loved it. I have also shot the .44 Magnum with one hand, once, and the kick almost caused me to hit my head with the gun. We used to set up watermelons and from about 50 yards blow them to pieces, it really can blow one's head "clean off." But, as of yet, I have never shot a .50 cal pistol and can only imagine what type of fire power this gun must have.

Here is a link that shows the sizes of different rounds. The round on the left is, obviously, the .50 cal and the one second from the right is a 5.56 mm round that is fired in an M16A2 service rifle, the primary rifle of the Marine Corps.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.50_BMG

Wow. And I thought the .50 caliber was powerful.

A .50 BMG round can produce between 10,000 and 13,000 foot pounds (between 14 and 18 kilojoules) or more, depending on its powder and bullet type, as well as the rifle it was fired from.

Also, the Model 500 has a "muzzle compensator" (the slots on the tip of the barrel) that is used to reduce the recoil by allowing gas to escape out the side of the barrel.

[Arnold 0]

I don't understand why one would need such an ungainly weapon. Wouldn't something lighter do the job just as well? If heavier fire power is needed, why not use a rifle or shotgun? I see the same thing with motorcycles that have engines bigger than in my car - what is the point?

[Paul's Here 0]

I don't understand why one would need such an ungainly weapon. Wouldn't something lighter do the job just as well? If heavier fire power is needed, why not use a rifle or shotgun? I see the same thing with motorcycles that have engines bigger than in my car - what is the point?

Some people like beautiful looking objects, some like target shooting, some like hunting, some like the feel of controlling power, etc.

[RayK 0]

I don't understand why one would need such an ungainly weapon. Wouldn't something lighter do the job just as well? If heavier fire power is needed, why not use a rifle or shotgun? I see the same thing with motorcycles that have engines bigger than in my car - what is the point?

I guess it matters what you are hunting. Something smaller is not going to bring down a bear.

I would also add that a powerful rifle allows our troops to shoot the enemy from distances that allow the sniper to be much safer. As a matter of fact, with the .50 cal sniper rifle you could shoot someone from more than a mile away and they would never know what hit them. But, I do not think this is what you are talking about.

[PhilO 0]

For some real 21st century technology, there's "metalstorm":

[PhilO 0]

Oops, hit reply accidentally. Metalstorm:

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/310622/fire_power/

http://fr.youtube.com/watch?v=d8hlj4EbdsE

The system uses electronically triggered rounds and has no moving parts except the projectiles themselves, which can either be conventional bullets or high explosive rounds, and can be built in handgun form (not sure how it's reloaded.)

Current maximum firing rate: 1 million rounds/minute, or about 17,000 rounds/second. A handheld weapon can blast out multiple rounds before there's time for recoil to occur.

My surmise is that the technology could also be potentially useful when coupled with radar for knocking out incoming ballistic missile warheads as well as aircraft, for area defense.

[Paul's Here 0]

For some real 21st century technology, there's "metalstorm":

Awesome. I want one for my backyard!!!

[Paul's Here 0]

Oops, hit reply accidentally. Metalstorm:

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/310622/fire_power/

http://fr.youtube.com/watch?v=d8hlj4EbdsE

The system uses electronically triggered rounds and has no moving parts except the projectiles themselves, which can either be conventional bullets or high explosive rounds, and can be built in handgun form (not sure how it's reloaded.)

Current maximum firing rate: 1 million rounds/minute, or about 17,000 rounds/second. A handheld weapon can blast out multiple rounds before there's time for recoil to occur.

My surmise is that the technology could also be potentially useful when coupled with radar for knocking out incoming ballistic missile warheads as well as aircraft, for area defense.

Can we use it to take out Chavez?

[RayK 0]

For some real 21st century technology, there's "metalstorm":

Awesome. I want one for my backyard!!!

I remember reading about this not to long ago, and I agree, it is awesome.

[Go 4 TLI 0]

I don't understand why one would need such an ungainly weapon. Wouldn't something lighter do the job just as well? If heavier fire power is needed, why not use a rifle or shotgun? I see the same thing with motorcycles that have engines bigger than in my car - what is the point?

I've seen these hand cannons at gun stores and thought of them as "guilty pleasure" pieces. For self defense purposes, a .45 is certainly better.

But the article pointed out that this pistol is marketed to hunters. In fact, it can take down an elk! Now things are making more sense. I don't hunt, but a former co-worker did, and he preferred bow hunting because he thought that hunting with a rifle wasn't challenging enough. I can imagine a similar reason for hunting with a pistol instead of a rifle. And I couldn't help but notice the scope rails integral to the top of the frame -- this pistol is meant for longer ranges.

As for it being the world's most powerful handgun, I have to disagree. The Thompson Contender is. It fires rifle cartridges including .308 Win. Here is a video of somebody firing it properly. The last (and only!) time I fired one, it nearly dropped me onto my backside.

[Paul's Here 0]

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As for it being the world's most powerful handgun, I have to disagree. The Thompson Contender is. It fires rifle cartridges including .308 Win. ----------

I'm not sure if there is difference between a handgun and a pistol, but the Thompson Contender website calls it a single shot pistol.

[Paul's Here 0]

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As for it being the world's most powerful handgun, I have to disagree. The Thompson Contender is. It fires rifle cartridges including .308 Win. ------

Isn't a 50 caliber bullet bigger than a .308 bullet?

[PhilO 0]

Isn't a 50 caliber bullet bigger than a .308 bullet?

The kinetic energy of a projectile is 1/2 mv², so a faster bullet is more damaging, assuming it delivers the energy to the target and doesn't just go through. Doubling the mass will double the energy, but doubling the velocity will quadruple it.

Future guns that use electrical energy with a railgun kind of concept could generate extremely high velocities, so even a small bullet would be extremely destructive, though at a certain point the bullet composition would have to change in order to withstand the aerodynamic stresses and heating effects. That could be a real downside tactically since every round would swiftly be glowing hot from air friction so effectively a tracer round, but on the other hand, with computer guidance of the aiming, it would not take more than one such round to kill an individual soldier regardless of any body armor.

[RayK 0]

Isn't a 50 caliber bullet bigger than a .308 bullet?

That could be a real downside tactically since every round would swiftly be glowing hot from air friction so effectively a tracer round, but on the other hand, with computer guidance of the aiming, it would not take more than one such round to kill an individual soldier regardless of any body armor.

I agree that the round would be warm and glowing but I do not think this would be a problem, most times. At night someone might see the round as it got closer to them but at such high speeds it would probably kill them before they could move. During the day the glow would most likely be undetectable and unheard. In other words, the round, whether visible or not, would most likely kill the person before they heard the blast or saw it coming. In Marine Corps Infantry School I was taught that a .50 cal machine gun could kill/go through 10 men lined up in a row before they would even have a chance to flinch.

[Go 4 TLI 0]

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As for it being the world's most powerful handgun, I have to disagree. The Thompson Contender is. It fires rifle cartridges including .308 Win. ----------

I'm not sure if there is difference between a handgun and a pistol, but the Thompson Contender website calls it a single shot pistol.

That's a good point. Is a 19th century dueling pistol a handgun? To qualify as a handgun, is the ability to fire more than once without reloading required? If so, what about derringers? At this point, I don't even have an opinion one way or another.

Isn't a 50 caliber bullet bigger than a .308 bullet?

The kinetic energy of a projectile is 1/2 mv², so a faster bullet is more damaging, assuming it delivers the energy to the target and doesn't just go through. Doubling the mass will double the energy, but doubling the velocity will quadruple it.

Yes, exactly. I should be more specific when I refer to "rifle ammunition" to say that I am referring to "high power" or high kinetic energy cartridges. But also, such bullets are generally pointed rather than rounded, flat-nosed, or hollow-point. This means that they are designed for supersonic flight and will thus have higher muzzle energies and maintain that energy over long ranges because they are less affected by atmospheric drag. I should also note that many rifles are designed to shoot pistol rounds. The cowboy lever action rifles come to mind. With them the point was that if a 19th century ranch hand was to spend a month's salary on such a rifle, it should at least have a common ammunition as his pistol.

So, let me throw out some numbers. The mil-spec .45 caliber round produces a 230 grain bullet with a muzzle velocity of 835 fps yielding a muzzle energy of 356 foot-pounds. Compare that to a 10-pound bowling ball traveling at 25 mph with a kinetic energy of 417 foot-pounds. Naturally, the smaller .45 slug will penetrate more deeply into soft tissue and cause much more cavitation damage than a bowling ball. I was trying to concretize the energy number, and I hope that my bowling ball calculation was helpful.

From the website for the S&W:

The "light" load is a 275-grain Barnes X copper hollowpoint bullet. Muzzle velocity is 1665 fps and it produces 1668 ft.-lb. of energy. It is more than adequate for any game up to and including elk.

A 400-grain jacketed softpoint at 1675 fps and 2500 ft.-lb. of energy is available for larger game.

Those heading to Alaska, Africa or even Jurassic Park will want the 440-grain hard-cast lead, gas checked, flat point load. At 1625 fps and 2580 ft.-lb. of energy, it will handle anything a handgun hunter is likely to pursue.

A 385-grain flat based spitzer load was to be available by press time. Cor Bon says this may be the best all-around load for the 500 S&W.

A sample .308 round weighs 186 grains, has a muzzle velocity of 2700 fps, and a muzzle energy of about 2700 foot-pounds. OK, I'm impressed. And intimidated. This piece looks like another golden opportunity for my arse to meet the ground.

BTW, .50 caliber machine gun rounds that RayK has been talking about have muzzle energies of 12,000 to 13,000 foot-pounds. They leave the muzzle at about 2700 fps, and weigh in at about 700 grains. I fired a .50 cal sniper rifle once. That wasn't recoil, it was a car accident!

[Carlos 0]

I would also add that a powerful rifle allows our troops to shoot the enemy from distances that allow the sniper to be much safer. As a matter of fact, with the .50 cal sniper rifle you could shoot someone from more than a mile away and they would never know what hit them. But, I do not think this is what you are talking about.

Considering that the bullet would hit them long before they even heard the report of the fired shot, sniper fire must have a profound psychological effect on it's targets or those nearby.

Don't those marine snipers have to spend literally an entire day sometimes just to carefully wiggle/crawl into position to make a shot? I can't even imagine the kind of sustained stress one would have to endure.

[RayK 0]

I would also add that a powerful rifle allows our troops to shoot the enemy from distances that allow the sniper to be much safer. As a matter of fact, with the .50 cal sniper rifle you could shoot someone from more than a mile away and they would never know what hit them. But, I do not think this is what you are talking about.

Considering that the bullet would hit them long before they even heard the report of the fired shot, sniper fire must have a profound psychological effect on it's targets or those nearby.

Don't those marine snipers have to spend literally an entire day sometimes just to carefully wiggle/crawl into position to make a shot? I can't even imagine the kind of sustained stress one would have to endure.

I would agree, the psychological effect of knowing your enemy is so close but unseen has got to put extra stress on most.

Gunnery Sergeant Carlos Hathcock once crawled over 1,000 meters that took him over 4 days so that he could shoot an NVA general, which he accomplished. While crawling closer and closer to the enemies camp he was almost stepped on by an enemy sentry and almost bitten by a viper that crawled past him. For Marines, Gunny Hathcock's book is very motivating along with giving many details of his life which is still in print today, Marine Corps Sniper.